“A Rose for Emily” and “Thus I Refute Beelzy”

 Groups # 3, 5, 6, 7 “Rose” — by Friday PM

Miss Emily hooks up with a Northerner. Discuss why the people find this to be poetic justice. Consider her background. Support with three Q.

Groups #4, 5, 6, 7, 8 “Beelzy — by Friday PM

Discuss how Big Simon is more traditional than he claims.  Support with three Q.

or

Identify how three descriptive passages control the story’s mood.

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28 Responses to “A Rose for Emily” and “Thus I Refute Beelzy”

  1. Boyd Moore says:

    The mood of the story is set through a long beginning passage in which the garden is shown to have ” tangled branches of the apple tree and pear tree planted too close together, as they always are in the suburbs” ( Collier, ” Thus I Refute Beelzy,” p.1) showing neglection and a dreary essence to the garden. Division between Mr. and Mrs. Carter begins when Mrs.Carter offers little opinion on little Simon’s actions because “[ Betty] knows what Big Simon’s ideas are.”( Collier, ” Thus I Refute Beelzy,” p.1) This changes the mood to hostile and offers information regarding Mr. Carter’s parenting. Mr Carter reassures Simon that ” [he will] learn how real [Mr.Beelzy] is,” prior to his attempted beating, and ultimately his death. This gives a eerie and morbid mood, in which the story ends .

  2. Jay says:

    “Thus I Refute Beelzy” is descriptive in many forms such as at the start Mrs Carter is starring out of a window she notices that the “long garden, agreeably neglected, ended in a waste plot.”(Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy” pg 1). This puts the mood as depressing because it mentions how there used to be a garden there but now it “ended up in a waste plot”(Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy” pg 1). Once you get in deeper of the story the mood swings to a horrifying mood. Small Simon has a friend name Mr Beelzy and Big Simon starts to ask question about Mr Beelzy ” What Why can’t you tell us just what he’s like”(Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy” pg 2), what I mean by this is Small Simon doesn’t want to tell his father what Mr Beelzy like because he’s scared that he might him away even though he is not real. Near the end the mood changes again to a scary mood when the mother hears a noise upstairs of their house she wants to go see what happened. She goes upstairs and looks in Small Simon room and sees ” [a] shoe, with [a] man’s foot in it”(Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy” pg 3). The mother realizes that her husband died and she isn’t sure on how he died. Small Simon “friend” Mr Beelzy his short for the devil, but the word devil comes from Beezlebub.

  3. JenStevens says:

    When Big Simon’s character is first introduced in the story, it’s apparent that he takes pride in the fact that he doesn’t follow the more strict and traditional morals of raising a child. When Big Simon corrects his son to call him Big Simon instead of Daddy, he says “at one time little boys had to call their father ‘sir’. If they forgot – a good spanking. On the bottom, Small Simon! On the bottom!” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 2). Big Simon tries to form a relationship with his son where they are on equal grounds, and he is his son’s friend rather than his superior. But Big Simon’s patience is wearing thin when Small Simon is reluctant to admit that Mr. Beelzy is not real, and Big Simon says “I have been longer in the world than you have, so naturally I am older and wiser.” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 4). He points out his superiority over the boy with his age and knowledge, and to prove that he is right. When Small Simon still will not admit that Mr. Beezly is not real, Big Simon loses his temper and falters. He goes against his own principles and shouts at his son that “if you can’t learn it at one end, you shall learn it at the other.” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 5). Unfortunately for Big Simon, his sudden change in discipline results in a bitter ending.

  4. Marla says:

    Miss Emily is a black lady of Select Street. As a younger, elegant lady that she was, there were many high-class men who would have for sure married Miss Emily, but her father whom she was close with, kept her away from all these men, not letting her choose for herself. He wanted the best for his daughter and needed her to find the perfect man, his controlling ways showed when “[The people] remembered all the young men her father had driven away,” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” page 40). None of these men were good enough for him. This is a sign of her punishment due to not going for these lovely rich men of the town that would have gladly married her, and in the end she was left with a lower class choice of men. Nobody in town respected her anymore because she was often thought of as picky and would not find anyone she liked enough to marry.
    Then, she finally finds her first beau; a Northerner. He goes by the name of Homer Barron and he is known for his brimming charm, and at first when he came to the town she lived in, the people gossiped and he was often the center of attention. Mr. Barron is a day laborer and lower class compared to Emily. The older ladies of the town did not think that it was right for Miss Emily to have an interest in a man like Homer Barron. He and Miss Emily would take his “yellow-wheeled buggy” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” page 41) for their Sunday afternoon drive each weekend. Each time the couple does this, they often get criticized because of non martial status and they set a bad example for other people. The town was sometimes unsure if Mr. Barron enjoyed being a single charming bachelor, or if he was actually bisexual [being] proven by “Homer himself [often] remark[ing]- [that] he liked men,” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” page 42). The lesson learnt from Miss Emily’s punishment was that she needed to choose for herself, because at the end of the day she had the last pick of the bunch.

    • rrnicholson says:

      Miss Emily is white. Watch your tense shifts. Did her father have anything to do with Emily’s rejected suitors? Did she really have a choice? Even in death does her father rule over Emily?

  5. In “Thus I Refute Beelzy” “The long garden, agreeably neglected, ended in a waste pot. Here a little summer-house was passing close by beauty on its way to complete decay”(Collier, Beelzy,pg.1) shows that the Carter’s house isn’t the best looking they don’t keep very good care of it and this tells us that the Carters are poor or just don’t bother to keep this house in nice shape which tells up they are sloppy and messy if they don’t like a neat and tidy looking house.
    When the Small Simon and Big Simon are talking and Small Simon says “‘ He said he wouldn’t let anyone hurt me,’” “‘He’d come like a lion, with wings on, and eat them up.’”(Collier, Beelzy, Pg.3) The boy turn and get very angry and straight to the point. The father doesn’t think it is true or does he think Mr. Beelzy is real after the boy says that about him but soon finds out after he is eat everything but his leg.
    The two ladies go up to “the second floor landing [where] that they found the shoe, with the man’s foot still in it , like that last morsel of a mouse which some-times falls unnoticed from the side of the jaws of the cat”(Collier,Beelzy,pg.3) this changes the mood from being scared that the Small Simon got hurt to Big Simon got eaten and the are very horrified only expecting the little scratches on the boy but it ends up to only being a foot and shoe left of the man.

  6. Adam M says:

    The mood of “Thus I Refute Beelzy” goes very dark as “They found the shoe, with the man’s foot still in it,” This shows Big Simon has been brutally killed while trying to beat his son. The mood turns serious when Small Simon’s mother questions, “You are not going to beat the child?” Mrs. Carter shows that she does not believe that beating Small Simon is the proper thing to do. As Mrs. Carter says, “What was that? He’s hurt him,” the mood becomes sad, as it is believed that the boy is being harmed by his father.

  7. JenStevens says:

    Miss Emily comes from a high-class family, and she lives in a large house with her father who raised her as a precious and elegant young woman. But the people of the town never had much respect for the Grierson family, they thought “the Griersons held themselves a little too high for what they were. None of the young men were quite good enough for Miss Emily.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40). The towns people didn’t appreciate being looked at as inferior to the Griersons just because they had less money in their pockets. After Miss Emily’s father’s death, the towns people began to see her on Sunday afternoons with a day labourer named Homer Barron. The ladies of the town began to gossip, and they thought it was absolutely ridiculous and “a Grierson would not think seriously of a Northerner.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 41). Rumours began to spread about Homer drinking with younger men, and some of the ladies felt he was a disgrace to the town and didn’t agree with how he carried himself. After the death of Miss Emily’s father, the people of the town thought “she had become humanized,” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40), and when rumours began to circle that Miss Emily and Homer Barren were to be married, the towns people couldn’t help but see the poetic justice in that. Miss Emily was always too good for even the best young men in town, and now to see her stoop to the level of marrying a day labourer made the towns people feel “not pleased exactly, but vindicated.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40).

  8. Krista says:

    A Rose for Emily
    When eligible men came to woo Miss Emily “None of the young men were not quite good enough for [her]” (Pg.40 ) this caused the gossip throughout the town. The narrator gives the thoughts of her community by describing Miss Emily father as a “spraddled silhouette in the foreground, his back to her and clutching a horsewhip, the two of them framed by the back-flung front door.” (Pg.40) This show how controlling he was in her life, so when he died she had no idea how to make proper social choices for herself.
    In the end the town assumes Emily marries Homer Barron even though it is seen as “a disgrace to the town”. (Pg.42) Their feelings soon change once “A neighbor saw the Negro man admit him at the kitchen door at dusk one evening. And that was the last we saw of Homer Barron.”(Pg.43) The people soon began to feel bad because they realized it wasn’t her fault but her that she chose such a low quality man, who seemed to have ‘run off’, but the “quality of her father which had thwarted her woman’s life so many times had been too virulent and too furious to die.” (Pg.43) Her fathers need to have the perfect man for his daughter backfired causing her to end up with someone whom not many average women would choose. This is the social justice, the Griersons need for the best caused Emily “as the last Grierson;” (Pg.41) to have very slim pickings in the end, providing her with the ‘rats’ of the litter.

  9. maceachernka01 says:

    Thus I Refute Beelzy
    Big Simone is more traditional then he thinks in many ways. Big Simons parenting skills are very traditional and modern. In the beginning he believes “Small Simone should “choose for himself,” (Collier, Beelzy, Pg.1) and Small Simone does, which is a traditional parenting tool of learning from mistakes.
    When Big Simone learns about Mr.Beelzy he takes the traditional explanation approach to Small Simone “There is no harm in a fantasy, old chap. There is no harm in a bit of make-believe.” (Collier, Beelzy, Pg.2)He tries to explain to his son the difference of reality and fantasy by explaining to him how if you don’t “know the difference between day dreams and real things, [then] your brain will never grow.” (Collier, Beelzy, Pg.2)
    In the end Big Simone resorts to the worst parenting technique there is. This technique was very common, especially during Big Simones time; it involved threatening and beating the child. Big Simone threatened Small Simone that “If you can’t learn it at one end, you shall learn it at the other.” (Collier, Beelzy, Pg.3)In this case Big Simone never came through on his threat.

  10. Holly Partridge says:

    Mr. Carter is more traditional than he thinks, creating his own traditions because he wants his son to learn from experiences. “That’s my way, the new way” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 2) he informs a house guest named Betty. Another one of Mr. Carter’s traditions is that he “washed [his hands] before and after everything he did.” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 2) He also has a habit of referring to his past telling his son “I was Small Simon once, just like you, and played the same games as you. Of course there were no aeroplanes in those days,” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 3) and that if his father had caught him doing nothing all day long he would have gotten spanked. Big Simon also has a custom to always get an answer. He feels like he must persist himself to get an answer from Little Simon demanding him to tell “which is pretend? Come on. Answer me. What is the pretend?” (Collier, “Thus I Refute Beelzy,” P. 4) This creates unnecessary tension between a father and son.

  11. Holly Partridge says:

    Miss Emily is portrayed as living in a higher class and implied by the fact that she lives in a mansion-like house “with cupolas and spires and scrolled balconies.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 36) She could have any man she desires but Miss Emily’s father controlled her whole life because “the Griersons held themselves a little too high for what they really were,” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40) and her father didn’t believe that any “of the young men were quiet good enough for Miss Emily.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40) It hints that Miss Emily just has no respect for her father when the word of his death gets out and “all the ladies prepared to call [her] at the house and offer condolence [however when] Miss Emily met them at the door, dressed as usual and with no trace of grief on her face” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 40) it implies, when she shows no concern or sadness for her father’s death, that she got fed up with his controlling nature and has no admiration for him at all. When Miss Emily sees Homer Barron “cuss[ing at] the niggers” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 41) it causes Emily to see her father in him. She also may be jealous that Homer is able to do as he pleases, such as “[liking] men, and it was known that he [drinks] with younger men in the elks’ club” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 42) so she lures him and poisons him with arsenic trying to destroy the image of her father. Arsenic is as “written on the box, under the skull and cross bones: ‘For rats.’” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 42) Being an informal presentation that Homer Barron was a rat which symbolizes that he’s a man that is deceitful or disloyal to someone in his life reminding Emily of her father because the “quality of her father which has thwarted her woman’s life so many times had been too virulent and too furious to die.” (Faulkner, “A Rose for Emily,” P. 43) It is poetic justice that she is able to live out killing a man that resembles her father and finally feeling complete although she’s, in all actuality, alone.

  12. kayleb says:

    In “A Rose for Emily” there is many very descriptive phrases that can create alot of moods for us as the readers. There may be some sort of religious type of mood that is attached to the words. Miss Emily’s hair was very short and ”[she] looked like a girl, with a vague resemblance to those angels in the colored chruch windows, sort of tragic and serene” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 41) Throughout the story I began to feel some suspense or heat if you will, between the Northerners and the Griersons, there was a time when a girl was angry during the time of construction of the town sidewalks and said ”Of course a Grierson would not think seriouslly [about] a Northerner, a day laborer” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 41)

  13. kayleb says:

    forget that mr nick, my bad, didnt mean to click post

  14. kayleb says:

    In “A Rose for Emily” there is many very descriptive phrases that can create alot of moods for us as the readers. There may be some sort of religious type of mood that is attached to the words. Miss Emily’s hair was very short and ”[she] looked like a girl, with a vague resemblance to those angels in the colored chruch windows, sort of tragic and serene” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 40) Throughout the story I began to feel some suspense or heat if you will, between the Northerners and the Griersons, there was a time when a girl was angry during the time of construction of the town sidewalks and said ”Of course a Grierson would not think seriouslly [about] a Northerner, a day laborer” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 41) The people thought that Miss Emily brought alot of problems onto herself, but felt very little pity for her as ”when she bought rat poison, the arsenic. That was over a year before they begun to say poor emily and her two cousins were visiting her ” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 41) It was clear to everyones mind that the town didnt want Miss Emily around, she bought the poison and the next day they ” all said she would kill herself, and [think] it’d be the best thing” (William Faulkner, A Rose for Emily. pg 42)

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